I am thinking about either a S&W MP15OR (optics ready) or a CMMG M4 Carbine. They are both about the same price at CDNN around $799. I am not sure I want a pure scoped AR, so I would probably get a carry handle and site for S&W.

Any opinions on either brand for reliability and/or performance? I am not an expert at all in ARs.

thanks!
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Not sure if I would call myself an expert at all, but I did build my AR and carry one every day for work.

check this spreadsheet out, it has all the technical data you could need to make a decision.

http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?k...=5&output=html

Depending upon what you were going to use it for, and what type(grain) ammo you are going to fire I would say go with the MP15. The only real drawback of this rifle vs. the other is that it has a 1 in 9" twist rate. the slower twist rate means it won't be able to stabilize heavy grain rounds. However if you aren't planing on shooting heavy grain rounds and are getting it for plinking purposes go with the MP15. as you can see from the chart it has better quality assurance and manufacturing processes. any questions about anything on that chart let me know.
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Oh yeah, chart is towards the bottom. Blue highlight on the chart for the most part = good. don't worry if something says mil spec either, mil spec isn't always best considering mil spec is usually lowest bidder.
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I saw that same deal in my email and was thinking about the S&W
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You can always find a pop up hollow site for the AR too. Carry handles are great but you can find add on irons as well. As with all weapons best to pick er up and see how she feels. I am a bit partial to the MP.
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Don't get a carry handle. Go with a Back up iron sight. I have one by Midwest Industries it is solid as a rock. Troy industries makes a great one as well, and of course magpul makes great stuff.

I attached pics of my baby, let me know if you have any questions.

My rifle is an LMT carbine upper, LMT lower and parts kit with a hogue grip. The rail system is a free float system that extends beyond the front sight. Next on the list are a new stock and getting an NFA stamp for a suppressor.
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A 1-9 twist will properly stabilize 55 and 62gr rounds which constitute about 90% of the offerings for the AR-15 to digest. If a heavier grain round is desired for hunting, I'd reconsider the AR-15 platform all together, and based on the OP's questions, I seriously doubt he'll be needing something along the lines of 77gr SMK's with a 1-7 barrel and throated chamber.

Bottom line, is a 1-9 twist will treat the average person just fine.


The biggest questions to consider when purchasing an AR-15 is A2 vs A3/A4 receiver, chrome lined vs not chrome lined, profile of the barrel and then finally 16" or 20" (with a multitude of others, but that builds up the primary lengths)

My recommendation is if you're looking for a gun to just do some plinking, maybe occasionally trying to hone in on accuracy, to look for an A3/A4 style AR-15 with a 1-9 twist chrome lined bbl, HBAR profile, and 16".

The velocity out of a 16" is sufficient for anything sub 250 meters when firing at paper, the chrome lined will allow for less strict cleaning practices and accommodate the heat generated by anyone wanting to just touch off a mag, HBAR to provide solid barrel harmonics for accuracy and weapon weight, then of course the A3/A4 flat top to allow for an easy transition between a scope, holo-sight, red dot or iron sites.

I'd recommend learning iron sites from the start to understand the fundamentals of the AR-15 platform and to learn how diverse POA(point of aim) is from POI (point of impact) due to the elevated sight height above barrel.


:-)


EDIT:: Had to add some gratuitous gun **** :-)

Image
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I have a S&W M&P 15 and I have not had any problems with it :-)

:-)
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MTB996,
Check out this link, lots of good info. CMMG's are highly rated.
http://forums.officer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=81462
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Sweet, Love that stock. Is that the Magpul short vertical grip? Very nice stick, what kind of upper and lower?

Like I said before 1/9 or 1/7 is all about what you are planning on doing with it, and what ammo you have available. Another big thing to look into is what round the chamber is designed for. I.E. .223 or 5.56. 5.56 can fire .223 but .223 chamber can not fire 5.56.
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Im also in the market for an AR and have been looking at a RRA, the Remington R-15 or now the CMMG. I do what the flat top receiver and a 16" or possibly longer barrel.

The thing is I have no clue where to really start in the way of upgrading different components lol
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Good catch on the 5.56/.223 :-) . Forgot to add that.

Another one to watch out for is the Wylde chamber which is similar to a 5.56 only a bit tighter for 'supposed' increased accuracy. The Wylde isn't terribly common though.


As for the rifle, it's got a Magpul UBR stock, MIAD grip, TD vert grip, KAC M4 RAS handguard, and TA31F ACOG. Upper and lower receivers are RRA parts, LPK is RRA, Barrel is a 14.5" Bushmaster chrome lined govt profile with a 1.5" Phantom flash suppressor permanently attached. :-)
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My advice is to buy the gun in the configuration you would like (ie. Flat top with a 16" barrel or longer). Learn to shoot the gun. Research what works and what doesn't. Compare that to your shooting style. THEN upgrade the parts.

That rifle I posted a pic of is about 4 years in the making. The only original parts left on it are the 2 receiver parts, the charging handle, and the bolt carrier group.
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I'm a 'build your own' guy, so if anyone has any specific questions about how to build an upper/lower, lay it on me.

That said, CMMG is a hell of a company. I have one of their .22lr conversion kits and ran into some troubles. They offered to ship it back and forth on their dime and fix it asap at no charge to me. Hard to beat customer service like that.
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I also agree to building your own.

I put together a 50 pg or so assembly guide a few years back. It's basically a PDF showing step by step assembly of upper and lower, tips & tricks, function testing, etc.

It's a bit dated which is why I'm rewriting it in my minimal free time, but it's not a bad place to start.

If anyone is interested in that as well, shoot me a PM and I'll e-mail you a copy. :-)
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How many of the posters here are members of ar15.com ? There's volumes of good information there.
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Put ar15 in front of a period followed by "c o m" and you will be taken to a magical world where you can learn whatever you desire about black sticks.
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nice timing Brad
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I'm also better looking :-)

(PS, you need to come shoot with us sometime)
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No, You need to come shoot with me sometime.
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