Said peace out, but I tried to edit this and it wouldn't let me.

Edit: Don't want anyone to think I am accusing anyone of not being able to discuss this in an intelligent manner, I am simply bowing out before the TOEs warnings of it going south happens.

Just a note, Greg, but I didn't see what you wrote as disrespcting anyone here or the discussion in general.

The topic at hand is one that really does involve a lot of emotion, deep thought by many people, and arguments that really do not lend themselves to just the written word. We will all read and interpret what is written here through the lens of personal experience and belief, which is sometimes forgotten but must be respected.

I do believe that as long as the discussion is more on the topic of motivations of the DD star and/or A&E that it really isn't violating the strictures of the board and thus likely to be allowed to run its course.

To me, it is sad that we are having this discussion at all given the extraordinary accepting nature that is the cigar community. I think that the vast majority of the people on CA really don't care and just want to connect with people who share their passion for cigars.

I wish everyone the merriest of Kwanzaa, the best of Chanukah, a joyous Solstice Season, a merry Christmas, the best of the season and an even more loving and joyous new year.

:-) :-)

In short, I myself did not like what was said in the GQ article, but I fully support the man's right to say what he wants. However, one must be willing to face the potential consequences of what one says or does, and the Robertsons seem to wish to avoid any fallout from this. They have the right to say whatever is on their minds. A&E has a right to react to what was said in any way they deem fit. GLADD and the NAACP . . . and Rick Warren and Charlie Sheen . . . have a right to voice approval or disapproval, as does every member of this forum. But NOBODY has the right, when consequences occur, to moan and cry and complain "But why? What did I do to deserve this? It's not fair!"

Yes, it is fair. And even if it's not fair, nobody ever said that life was supposed to be fair.

Really, you believe this? Wow! I am so sorry that life has treated you so poorly that you believe all people are this way.

It is human nature to desire to be part of a community.

It has also been proven in studies that hatred/animosity/bigotry/racism (whatever you want to call it) is a learned behavior. I personally believe there is only one [1] race, the human race, and there are just simply slight genetic differences which appear outwardly to be great differences [melatonin causes change in skin color for instance]. Studies have been done by placing children who had never had interaction with others whose skin color was different, into a room together - and those children never batted an eye and simply played together.

My own sons had their early years without exposure to those whose melatonin amounts caused differences in appearance. And when we were at a hotel pool one day with a mixed bag of children, they immediately found the children to join in play who were their size and age - and the skin color affected them not at all. When asked later who they were playing with in the pool, we were given names, nothing about their physical attributes was even mentioned.

Do I know people who would be labeled bigot? You betcha! I think that if we stopped thinking of these slight genetic differences (skin color, etc...) as being different races, some of the problems that do still exist would decrease. Of course the thought that these genetic differences are different races is something that we can larger blame on early evolutionists (Darwin being one who thought & taught such).

Peace of the Lord be with you.

Has nobody realized that these people kill ducks!!!1!!111one
THE AGONY!!!
:-)

Hey, someone has to kill them so that I can eat them. :-)

Reverend, you are absolutely right that the innocence of children does not display the same social and cultural failures so common in the supposedly mature. And you and I agree that there is but one race, which we are all a part. (The same could be said for the, perhaps, not so innocent sex play amongst children, which can be as "egalitarian" as the worst of adult degenerates.) It tempts one to wish youthful innocence could survive childhood, and the flawed lessons taught the young by their presumed "wiser" elders. Sadly, this is not the case, and as you have doubtless ministered to many sinners you know this. Parents teach their children, good and bad.

My point, as well or poorly as was my attempt to make it, was that a distinction need be made between racism and bigotry. The former exists, yet does not necessarily lead to bad actions. The latter too often does. Robertson's remarks about happy black field hands singing while toiling in high cotton, never expressing the slightest vexation towards Mr. Charlie . . . well, I don't care if he was working right beside them, and was only reporting what he witnessed. It is naive, it is offensive, and is at least on the "bad' end of racism, if not full-blown bigotry. And again, I repeat why this debate exists, not who is right or wrong. It is a debate because A&E decided it did not want to continue a relationship with this man. They may be right, they may be wrong, but why can they not do what they want? True, the Robertsons and their fans have the right to voice their disapproval of the decision, but they have no more right than does A&E, does GLADD, does the NAACP, or does little ol' tongue-tied me.

And the happiest of Christmas season to you, Rev, and to your family, your friends, and your flock.

I'm happy Craig posted this. I posted the same observation in my words earlier, but in order to add some teeth to my argument, I gave up some info that shouldn't be on the board, and deleted it.
I think Rick overreaches a bit, but is 100% accurate. Maybe not "our culture", but a good portion of the world at large, I suppose. Heck, I don't know.

Nobody ever has to compromise convictions to be compassionate.
"Love thy neighbor as I have loved you." Unconditional love. Solved.

Todd, can you imagine how much they could make if they made Canada Goose calls? Know how you can tell they aren't fit to eat? Cause there's hundreds of them within walking distance of my house. :-)

Is there a way for freedom and liberty to win this so called "debate"? There always is, but sadly it seems to me no one cares to start with that question on any major issue:-)

Well stated, Mark.

With all due respect to those interested in civil debate, this thread has been on the edge since post # 1. In the best interests of everyone, I am closing the thread and encourage everyone to enjoy the holiday and count your many blessings.